Trauma Is the Gateway: Addiction, Shame & Recovery | Jennifer Chase
Episode 44
Jess sits down with Jennifer Chase—certified life coach and founder of Rise Addiction Life Coaching—to rethink a well-worn myth: Is trauma the real gateway to addiction? Jennifer shares her generational story of alcoholism, childhood sexual abuse, a brain-tumor surgery that led to opioid dependence, and the exact tools and reframes that helped her reclaim voice, power, and peace.
We cover:
The controversial reframe: “Substance wasn’t the problem—it was my solution.”
The “perfect family” facade, secret-keeping, and why truth-telling is liberation
Shame → use → more shame: how forgiveness (including of her abuser) broke the loop
The hardest mirror: when her son became addicted to her prescribed opiates
Codependency ≈ addiction: why connection is the antidote to both
Practical tools: meetings, movement, meditation, journaling, music, and “choosing your hard”
A closing thought
Healing isn’t linear. When we shine light on shame, we make space for breath, choice, and self-worth.
Chapters
00:00 — TW + welcome
01:05 — “Perfect” outside, chaos inside
04:40 — Truth-teller, not “black sheep”
08:48 — Brain tumor → opioids: “Where has this been?”
12:50 — Shame spirals & escalating use
14:55 — When your child mirrors your pain
18:58 — Rock bottom → treatment
21:05 — Forgiving to reclaim power
25:12 — Families, enabling & new boundaries
29:00 — Choosing your hard
34:20 — Tools you can use today
40:05 — Emotional safety in unsafe systems
46:40 — “The cave you fear…”
49:55 — What life after trauma means today
Resources & Links
Jennifer’s website: https://riseaddictionlc.com
TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@jenchase
Find support: AA & Al-Anon (search local meetings in your area)
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Jennifer Chase (00:00.48)
I'm in my bed high and I said out loud as though there were 15 people sitting in that room with me. Where the hell has this been my whole life? It was the first moment that I felt as though I could finally take a deep breath. It is peace. It is wholeness. It is worth that comes from within me rather than looking at it from somebody giving it to me from the outside world.
And it brings tears to my eyes because my God, fought for it for a long time. And it took me a lot of years to get here. But life after trauma is the life that I always dreamed of. The love and the serenity and the peace and the worthiness and the value and all of the things that I fought so hard for and so long for in my life. That is life after trauma today.
Jess Vanrose (01:01.262)
This episode contains discussions of trauma, abuse, and other potentially sensitive topics that may be activating for some listeners. Please take care while listening and pause if you need to. Your well-being is what matters most. Hi Jennifer, welcome to Life After Trauma.
Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited.
I am excited as well. You are a certified life coach and founder of Rise Addiction Life Coaching, helping families break cycles of addiction and reclaim their voice and power. I'd love to start with your own story. What was life like for you growing up in a household affected by addiction?
Yeah, so I'm a great granddaughter of an alcoholic, a granddaughter of an alcoholic, a daughter of an alcoholic. I have generations of this thing in my house. My family, it was just normal behavior, right? Like if we're at the lake, then they start drinking at like 9 a.m. and I don't remember an evening where my dad didn't come home from work and drink some sort of alcohol. So my dad was a pretty successful businessman, a very, you know.
a put together alcoholic, if you will. And that was kind of how all my family was. My grandfather was a very distinguished man in the community that he lived in. And so it wasn't the typical, it wasn't a home, if you will, that looked bad from the outside. It actually looked really good from the outside, right? Like people thought that I had a blessed, if you will, childhood. But what was going on from the inside looking out were for sure a lot of challenges. I unfortunately am a statistic.
Jennifer Chase (02:42.914)
that says one out of every four little girl and one out of every six little boy who is kind of dealing with that kind of addiction in their home is sexually abused. And I was sexually abused by my mom's dad. There were a lot of things going on in my childhood. And even from a very young age, I remember observing the world as many of us do when we've experienced trauma. We become very observant of the world. And I remember thinking like,
There's a common denominator to all of this, right? There's a common denominator to my grandfather hurting me and my dad who was my guy. Like I loved my dad, but he was inconsistent at best, right? Because of his alcoholism. So the common denominator of that, the common denominator of having a mom who I didn't feel protected by, like my mom, if she speaks English, I speak French, right? If she speaks German, I speak Chinese. Like we've just never really...
understood each other on that level and I thought that was wildly crazy, right? Like I didn't see another mom that I felt that was true for and so the denominator to all of this was me. Right? Like I was the common denominator. I was the problem. And I remember feeling that at a very, very, very young age.
would be really hard and I want to talk for a second about that feeling of when what is shown or what people see from the outside is not what is happening on the inside and how incredibly difficult that discrepancy can be to live through that.
people might not believe you. Did you ever have moments like that where you maybe tried to ask for help and...
Jennifer Chase (04:36.59)
people were like, no, this is not. I did. am, so lots of people call us black sheeps. I like to call us truth tellers, right? I was the one in my family system that was like, this is like red flag, red flag, red flag, this is something's going on. But everybody, there was a secret that was going on and it required me to sit down and be quiet, right? In order to keep everybody's secret.
And that's not even, that wasn't even conscious, right? I'm talking about this almost from a subconscious generational outlook. So I remember very specifically when I was in the fifth grade, this is just an example. I was in the fifth grade and I went to school. had like painted on with eyeshadow, a big black eye, what I thought looked like a black eye. I'd love to see a picture of it today. And I went to school and I said that my dad had hit me like my person.
Thank
Jennifer Chase (05:31.03)
Like the one person that I loved more than anything in the world, I had said that he had hit me and I reflect on that now. And the exact reason that I did that was for another adult to get down on my level and say, sweet baby girl, what is going on in your home? Yeah. Right? But it didn't happen because of the way it looked from the outside. And instead of them saying that to me, they would call my parents and say, come get this crazy one. Like you got other...
two other ones that seemed fine, but this one is off the rails. Like come get her, you got a problem. And that discrepancy, that conflict of why it was like I was a lion in a cage roaring and nobody could hear me because of the way that my family presented themselves from the outside.
It can completely understand and relate to this because my, so my abuse came from my stepfather and we were very active in a church. And when we were at church, that whole community saw him as this wonderful, fun, loving dad who was so much fun with all the kids in the church and just everybody loved him. And when
I finally went and asked for help. I was told right to my face, stop lying about your dad. It's those moments where it makes you doubt yourself, right? And then that's such a big part of trauma as well as coming back to being able to trust yourself. But I also wanted to say your comment before about that subconscious feeling of
we have a secret to keep that right there, that's survival. That was an inborn, like, I know what I need to do to survive here.
Jennifer Chase (07:27.448)
Well, and my desire to be the truth teller put all of that at risk, right? That generational secret keeping, that survival mode, it put all of it at risk. And so as, you I was the problem because if they were to look at it any other way, we'd have to start getting honest about what was going on.
Can you take us back to the moment where you realized that you were repeating the same cycles that you grew up with?
Growing up, I didn't know much, right? I didn't know if I was gonna get married, have babies, go to college. Like, I didn't know much. But I could tell you with, like, my full chest that I was not gonna become an alcoholic. Like, I looked at the chain, like, the generations chain of this thing. I thought that the adults that had come before me, they were just purely weak, right?
In fact, one time when I was in my early twenties, I called both of my parents and told them that I had more courage in my pinky finger than either one of them had in their full bodies. Right? That's how determined I was to break the chains of this thing. Like I felt like it was a decision that they had made not to do that. And that was not going to be me. So.
Thanks.
Jennifer Chase (08:50.062)
That was my whole mindset going into my adulthood and going into being a wife and a mom. But on January 3rd, 2003, I was suffering with a headache. I had had them my whole life. I had had lots of different MRIs and CAT scans and all the things. And so I'd gone to the hospital and had a shot and came home and it didn't resolve. And it felt like something was wrong. And so I went back to the hospital.
and they found a hemorrhaging brain tumor and gave me about 12 hours to live if I didn't go into emergency surgery and try to remove that tumor. And even then they weren't sure because of the hemorrhaging whether it was going to be successful or not. So they removed the tumor. Obviously, I by the grace of God survived. But because of the bleeding, they caused pretty massive nerve damage in my head, which led me to chronic pain. And that is when I was introduced to opiates.
I remember the day, the time. I can almost tell you exactly where, I mean, I can tell you exactly where it was, but like the time in the day. I'm laying in my bed. I was on opiates. I was high. I could hear my family in the living room. So we were kind of, we were like, you know, you can throw balls, you can tackle each other. It's pretty much mayhem, right? There was a couple of things that you can't break, but other than that, it's whatever. And I could hear them playing, my husband and my two kids.
And I'm in my bed high and I said out loud as though there were 15 people sitting in that room with me. Where the hell has this been my whole life? It was the first moment that I felt as though I could finally take a deep breath. It was the first moment where I felt like I could fit in my skin. It was the first moment where it was like I didn't care that I had been abused or that my dad was an alcoholic or that my mom didn't protect me or that my siblings didn't really like me, right? It was...
In that moment, I was like, my God, this is what everybody else feels. Like this feeling of it's gonna be okay. And I tell people all the time, anybody that will listen, I tell them, substance is not the problem, right? It is the solution to the problem. I was addicted to substance that day, emotionally. it was before I was even addicted to it.
Jennifer Chase (11:14.53)
from a physical standpoint. And substance was the solution to that feeling, the burden that it took away, the heaviness that it took away, the shame that it lessened, right? It felt like it neutralized the shame that I experienced as a child. And from that day moving forward, it was the solution for a really long time. It was a solution.
that the consequences did not outweigh the benefits for a really, really long time because the benefits were so high.
Wow, that is obviously a very interesting perspective. Like, I have not heard this before and I thank you so much for sharing this. It completely makes sense that it would be such a huge relief in that moment for you. I can't imagine the struggle that would have come after that.
how did that moment change the way you saw yourself?
The moment that I just shared with you, that moment. Yeah. Well, I think this is the interesting thing about trauma and addiction. And people ask me sometimes, like, do you think that marijuana is the gateway drug to other drugs or whatever? And I 100 % tell them, I actually think trauma is the gateway drug. Right? And substance use and trauma have a unique relationship, a complicated relationship. So I started using substance with a tremendous amount of shame.
Jennifer Chase (12:51.992)
but my shame, I impacted and compounded my shame from my addiction, right? So I started with a lot and I ended with even more. And that wasn't immediate, that sort of creeped into this, because like I said, the benefits of it outweighed the consequences for so very long, that I would just use more substance to neutralize the shame. So at the beginning, it wasn't as much substance and my life was pretty normal and the relationships were pretty normal.
And then as I compounded that shame, I had to use more substance to neutralize that shame and keep it in balance. And so that progressively made everything worse, relationships worse. The relationship with my nuclear family, my mom, my dad, my sister, my brother was awful. I had a lot of resentment and a lot of anger and I needed somewhere for it to go.
And oftentimes that's where it went. The relationship with my husband obviously got very complicated. And the truth of the matter is I not only didn't break the chains of this thing, but I added a link because when my son was a senior in high school, I learned that I had inadvertently become my son's drug dealer. so, you know, the consequences of my addiction are far reaching.
Cut.
Jennifer Chase (14:15.112)
and devastating. And I'm grateful we've been, you know, that's a whole, and I'd love to share it if that's direction you'd like to go. But you know, my family has had to be transformed and there's a lot of gratitude in that, right? Like I think if I hadn't walked through what I walked through, I'm not sure we would be the humans that we are today. And I'm grateful for that. But the shame that my addiction caused, it was almost like I was,
I surrendered and gave up to it's like, okay, all of those people were right. I am a piece of shit. Right? They weren't wrong. They've been trying to tell me since I was a three-year-old and I fought the fight for a long time and there was a surrender in the middle of that addiction where I was like, you win, you're right. I am useless. I am trash. And I think that that's when it really started spiraling for me.
I definitely would like to go deeper into this. that shame piece is so big for trauma survivors. mean, for human beings in general. Especially for trauma survivors. And yeah, so I would love if you can share more about that, your story and how that really affected your life and your son's life, your family, how that all shifted.
So when I got sick with my brain tumor, my kids were two and five. And when I got sober, my kids were 18 and 21. So they lived the majority of their life with a mom who was an addict. And I think one of the things that was complicated about my story, and I think ultimately created some longevity to it, was that I had this medical component, An actual medical component where I have
I've been to the Mayo Clinic and I've had lots of surgeries to try to fix what happened during the brain tumor removal. And so I think my family, my husband particularly, had a lot of compassion and empathy for that medical piece. And because of that, rescued and enabled the addiction piece. So like if I had a prescription that was due at midnight on Tuesday, he was at the pharmacy at 1210.
Jennifer Chase (16:39.65)
picking up the prescription, right? He was holding all the plates in the air that I no longer was able to manage. So he was managing the kids and getting them to their sports and cooking dinner while I was in a vegetated state, almost laying in my bed. And that obviously became to impact our relationship, like the intimacy of our relationship, the connection of our relationship. So not only did I affect that, but my children didn't
really get to see modeled a healthy relationship or because there was a lot of conflict. There was obviously he was resentful, I was resentful. Again, I was looking at any place that I could place my anger. Whether it was the direct TV person that I call on the phone or whether it was my husband or whether it was one of my kids' coach, Wherever it was, I was looking to land my anger. And that was a ripple effect.
And so when my son started to deal with his own mental health situations from having me as a mom, having my biology, he started smoking weed, I think when he was about 14 or 15. And I knew that, didn't really, I thought, he'll grow out of it. You know, it's just a typical boy thing to be doing. lots of people end up, you know, sometimes can smoke.
weed and not become addicted. And I didn't know if he had the biology or didn't have the biology. Um, but it was a fall day in 2016 when, uh, the pieces, the puzzle pieces, uh, definitely moved together. And I realized that my son had become addicted to opiates. And in that moment, I wish I could tell you that that was the day that I quit. Right. I wish I could tell you that that moment I was like,
this is it, I'm done. But I, in that moment, if I was being honest with you, I wasn't ready to give up my solution, right? I wasn't ready to deal with my shame without a counterbalance. I wasn't willing to deal with the relationships that I had tanked. I wasn't really to deal with my kids' anger and the reality that their childhood had been. And so even knowing that my son was addicted to my opiates,
Jennifer Chase (18:58.73)
I switched into a, how am gonna have less of them in their house? How can I lower my tolerance? How can I, right? Like, how can I keep them from him better? How can I hide them better? It was never like, stop using. And so I went through about nine months of like, the truth is the solution for me was suicide, right? I thought that if I could complete suicide that I would.
It was the most selfless and loving thing that I could do for the people that I loved, that I didn't know how to show love anymore. was such a shell of an empty human of myself. So that period of time, I explored that option quite a few times and was unsuccessful. And so I got to the point it's like, how do we get here? What are we going to do? Like, this isn't working. Like, what in the hell has happened?
I decided that my son graduated from high school on a Friday and I checked myself into a facility on a Sunday. And I went into the mindset of that as I'm gonna learn how to use like a gentle lady. I'm gonna lower my tolerance. I'm gonna do all of the things that I said earlier. And after 28 days in that facility, I learned that the only way that I was gonna save my son was to save myself.
That's powerful. So you have been the addict, the daughter, and the mom. What did reclaiming your voice and power look like in each of those roles?
So the interesting thing about the child perspective is my dad died from alcoholism in 2015 before I got sober. So I was, again, my dad was my guy, right? I loved my dad desperately. There were some things I think I probably in this, version that I am today would have liked to have said to him that maybe I needed to say to him. But for the most part, I try really hard to do this thing for the both of us now, right?
Jennifer Chase (21:07.978)
I recognize that my dad chose alcohol as a solution to something as well. And I validate now that my dad was doing life for the first time, just like I was doing life for the first time. And if I'm honest, my dad was 10 times the father that the father that he was given. And some of those struggles and battles that he experienced as a child are the reason why he chose alcohol to begin with. And so there's been a lot of
healing in that area for my dad. The part that I've experienced with my grandfather is I had a spiritual moment when I was getting sober. I'd been sober for probably 30 days and we were standing in a circle. Again, I can remember it so vividly and it was like something slapped me in the face and I was like, you are giving your power away to this man every single day of your
life. You are willfully handing it over to him. He changed who you were, the very fiber of who you were when you were three or four years old. And then you have willfully as adult just handed it over to him. And in that moment, I knew that the only way to get my power back was to forgive him. And not for him, not because he deserved it, not because if he were sitting in front of me today, I would want to have a relationship with him or any of that.
but forgive him because I deserved that. I deserved to release him from having that power over me anymore. And I think to reclaim my power as a human, it was beginning to tell that story. Every time I said that I was abused, a little bit of my own power was reclaimed. My story was reclaimed. And oftentimes when you're,
raised in an abusive or traumatic situation. Because my worth was tied to this dynamic or this family dynamic, I always like, it would only be good if somebody told me it was good. It was only true if somebody told me it was true. It was only worthy if somebody told me it was worthy. So reclaiming my story and saying it out loud, regardless of who didn't like it or who didn't.
Jennifer Chase (23:29.996)
believe my version of it or saw it the same way that I saw it was the beginning of reclaiming my truth. But this is the thing. This is life work for me, right? I've been doing it for a hot second and there are still days where I wake up and it feels as though I'm starting this process all over again. And so it's really the life work of staying in that place and honoring my experience and
and the messiness of it and the complication of it, if you will, to continue to step into that power. And the mama part, you know, I spent the first six years or so of my professional life after getting sober, working in more of a treatment atmosphere with the addict. I...
There's a couple of things that have happened that have changed the trajectory for me as where now I'm working with families. the first one was I had been sober for about three months. I'm driving in the car with my husband and I'm on cloud nine. I'm like, my gosh, I said, I did this in group and I'm connecting with these people and we're doing this and we're having the time of our lives. And it's like, you know, I'm being fulfilled, right? I'm getting connection and I'm doing all of the things that I always wanted to do.
but wasn't able to. And I looked over at him and he was deadpan stone-faced. I just kind of looked at him and he said, I'm really happy for you. I'm really glad that you're sober. But I went through this too. And who the hell do I have? And I remember just like not even knowing what to say.
Yeah.
Jennifer Chase (25:15.436)
And so the relationship and the experience that I had as a mama, that experience with my husband, the relationship as a daughter of an alcoholic, it became this undeniable pole for me that it's time to go help families. It's time to go help the mamas. It's time to go help the people that have this dynamic in their family that doesn't understand what it's like to be in this brain of an addict. It's time to start.
helping people articulate feelings and walk outside of this really yucky dynamic that is, you know, the enabling and the addict, right? And the enabler wants the addict to be responsible 100 % of the time and the truth is they aren't, is equally responsible but not completely responsible. And relearning and talking about that it feels counterintuitive sometimes to love an addict.
about what's helpful and contributing to the solution and what's contributing to the problem. And I just feel like it is finally what makes sense of my life, right? It is finally from the big picture, I can look at it and go, that's why I went through all of that. That's why I experienced all those really hard things, right? It's so that I can be right here, right now doing this work, helping as many people as I can to try to untangle this thing.
Yeah, and that's a powerful place to be and to come from, right? I also, wanted to add that, so again, coming back to that shame piece that you've spoken about so much, I was actually just talking to somebody today and I told them like, shame, shame can't live where we shine a light on it, which is why
in telling your story, you feel this sense of freedom because that shame starts to dissipate and it feels liberating.
Jennifer Chase (27:24.686)
I was talking with a gentleman earlier today that believes that he was an addict, but the day he stopped, he was no longer an addict, right? And there's this shame to even saying that I identify as an addict, right? And this is one time we were at a social event, my husband said, you have to tell everybody that you're a recovering addict. And for me, there is zero shame attached to addiction for me anymore, right?
And that's why it doesn't bother me to tell anybody that will listen that I, because I think it's a superpower, right? Like I really, really do. think we are two sides of the same coin and addiction can be, I think what society thinks of addiction as super dark and hard. But the flip side of that is that I believe because I am an addict, because of the way that my brain works, if I can use that in
powerful way instead of a destructive way, it is actually a ginormous superpower. And so for me, there is no shame attached to it.
That's so powerful and an incredible place to come from. What were the first small practical steps you took to start living for yourself?
Yeah, I remember the shift that I had when I was in the treatment facility. Like I was telling you, I went in trying to save my son. And I remember the shift of, this is about you, right? This is about your healing. This is about you reclaiming your power. And so when I got out of that treatment center, I remember I used to tell my husband, I got sober in the rooms of AA.
Jennifer Chase (29:06.882)
I don't go to as many meetings as I used to go to, that's where I started to get traction on top of treatment facilities and connection. I remember telling my husband the first time that I was like, is about me. I said, I may leave at any moment to go to a meeting. I may leave in the middle of dinner. I may leave at a social event. And I never want you to take it personally, but I have to do this for myself.
And I came from a place that I didn't do anything for myself. Right? I didn't do anything. It was like, yes, just run over the top of me with a tractor. I'll be fine. Right? And it was the first time that I was like, no. And I did it at first. was out of love for everybody else. I love everybody so much. And I want this so much for everybody else that I'm gonna like put my whole.
into this, which means I'm going to go to meetings whenever I need to. And that really started giving me the confidence to look at this from a perspective. You I think especially as women in this world, we're told that we can't fill from an empty cup. We're said that with words, but really the world gives us, you know, the feeling that we should in fact give from a really empty cup. That we should be pulling from the Zahara Desert, right?
from the empty cup, right? Like it's selfish to fill your cup up. You're not thinking about others. You're not loving your kids. All the things that we get told, and a lot of it subconsciously as women, but again, as trauma survivors, we observe. So spoken word becomes a lot less powerful than the observations and the unspoken word. And so I came from that perspective that, yeah, they say don't give from an empty cup, I couldn't have been emptier.
And so it was for sure a shift and especially because when I first got sober, like my family didn't want me to relapse. They didn't want me to be high, but they didn't really like me. Right? And so they were kind of walking on eggshells. Like it wasn't time yet, but I'd been sober for probably a year or so. And all of a sudden it felt fair game for resentments to start coming. Right? They started to be able to finally.
Jennifer Chase (31:29.804)
speak their piece about some things that they had been holding in for a while. And so as I was all of a sudden doing everything differently and in fact making decisions that were best for me, that was even harder because they had some resentments about, you know, the past 15 years. And so to say that it's been a journey to navigate this thing, I mean, my husband and I are gonna celebrate our 29th wedding anniversary next week. And it's only by the grace of
something much bigger than me that we've been able to survive this thing. And I would love to tell you that my son has been sober since September of 2020. that was, he was, used for another three years after I got sober, the hardest three years of my whole life, because what I wanted to do was, I mean, his use was a mirror of my shame, right? And what
The old version of me would have done was just said, screw this, right? I'm just gonna go get high. I can't deal with this pain. But I felt so strongly that that kid deserved me to do hard. Like he finally deserved me to model hard. And what that translated for was I'm gonna do, I'm gonna stay sober, come hell or high water and show you that it's possible to do hard. But it was for sure the hardest three years of my whole life.
can't even imagine how challenging that would have been. How did you find the strength to get through all of this? Like you became sober and then the resentment started coming, which it's fair for them to state those. But and then having your son, like how did you have the strength to get through all of this?
was born a little different. I don't know. I think, like I've always known that I have something inside of me that can persevere. I've always kind of, know, when I'm at the table with a group of people and like, you know, I can handle hard. I didn't display it for a lot of years. Like I quit for a while, right, doing hard, but.
Jennifer Chase (33:48.94)
I think was the cards that I was dealt for whatever reason. And I used to be resentful about that. I used to have some resentment to God that for whatever reason I was meant to do hard throughout my life. But the truth is the parts as I've gotten sober and kind of this journey with my family since, it didn't feel unbearable. It felt like I finally needed to be the version of myself that they deserved all along. And so that
desire to be who they deserved gave me so much internal strength, right? I am a stubborn, stubborn gal. and my husband is too, like we don't stay married for 29 years if we're not the, maybe the stubbornest people on the planet. And, and it, it, suits me in times, right? Because it gives me this, I'm not quitting. I'm, I'm going to, I'm going to keep the faith and keep going. And I tell addicts when I, when I have a
the opportunity to sit with a group of addicts. I always tell them like, I get to choose my heart, right? Being sober and being in recovery and dealing with the dynamics and rebuilding these relationships is really, really hard. But you know what is also pretty damn hard? Being a drug addict, right? And so today I get to wake up every morning and say, okay, which heart are you choosing? Cause we're not getting out of this thing without it being hard. None of us.
even if you haven't been through trauma or experienced addiction in your family, life is hard. And so for me, like not even, it's not even the strength, it's just this understanding that that's just what we just do hard. And I'm also not a martyr, right? Like if it sucked, I probably wouldn't be doing it. And the truth is my life is exponentially better since I have gotten sober and you know, the ever growing mindset and the...
I always tell people, if you're not growing, you're dead. And I've got no time to be dead. I spent a lot of time dead, right? Like I wasted a lot of time and I don't have time for it anymore. And so if I'm not perpetually growing, if I'm not always making myself uncomfortable, then I'm complacent and that's not the direction that I wanna go.
Jess Vanrose (36:09.1)
I absolutely love your comments about doing the hard things because that is actually a motto that I have for myself. think it might have been, but is it Brene Brown? Yes. Or is it?
no, Glennon Doyle is the one that always says, we can do hard. Yep. I love her, by the way. I love them both.
Yes, both, they're amazing. But yes, I tell myself all of the time, you can do hard things. And that mindset of knowing that either option is going to be hard. Even taking that outside of addiction. If we want to talk about like, okay, do I go to the gym or not?
Do what? Go to the Yes! That's a good example. Yes!
Even-
Jess Vanrose (37:00.234)
Like that is a choice of which hard do you want.
And I think it's interesting with addicts because a lot of us think that we're the only ones doing hard, right? Like I've said this before to people and they're like shaking their heads like, yes, yes, I feel that way. We feel like everybody has a manual of life when they're born, right? Like you have a flat tire, page 56, when you get your heart broken for the first time, page 135. And it was at a print when I was born, right? And they were like, sorry, sweetheart, you're gonna have to muddle through this thing on your own.
but it feels like everybody else knows what they're doing. And it's interesting and it's probably true for everybody. I just have more access, I think, to the way that addicts think, but so many of us are like, we think we're the only ones that life is this hard for. And it's just not true.
It's really not.
Yep, it's not.
Jess Vanrose (37:56.724)
It's not. Everybody has hard, it's a different hard, but everybody has hard. So now you help women create emotional safety in unsafe environments. And that must be such a, I can't even, why don't you tell me how that feels for you to go from where you were to where you are now?
I was just telling somebody today, the feeling of being allowed into somebody's suffering, I don't know how to describe this, right? The trust that somebody has to allow me into the sacred space of suffering is, it can bring me to tears. Seriously, thinking about it, right? Thinking about the gratitude, thinking about the blessing really, right?
of people allowing me into that space. I've done some hard things in my life. And what I'm living today is a reward to that persistence and that perseverance and that consistency and that I'm never quitting kind of mentality. And the life that I'm experiencing today has finally healed that version of me because now
It makes sense. Now I understand why I had to walk through it. Now I can find peace and forgiveness in it because I said this to my mom. My mom and my relationship is very complicated still to this day. And we were having a conversation and she's like, will you ever forgive me? And I said, mom, that's old news. I forgave you so long ago. How can I have gratitude for the life that I have today if I cannot?
have gratitude for my past. That is so overwhelming. There are days where that takes my breath away in the best way. People allowing me into their suffering is a gift that I will never, never, never take for granted.
Jess Vanrose (40:01.364)
I hope people replay that last 15 seconds and really take that message in because wow, what are some of your go-to tools for women who are ready to break free from codependency or other struggles but still feel scared to step into that change?
Yeah, think there are a few. But I think the first one is, so codependency, very similar to addiction. The consequences have to be outweighing the benefits, right? Somebody has to be willing to say, I no longer am finding the value in this way that I used to work. And so it takes a certain amount of openness and readiness on their part. And then the tools that we use are
I'm a pretty shoot it straight kind of gal. And so for me, it's like, we start making friends with the worst case scenario. We start facing our fears, right? We start talking about where our anxiety and our depression is coming from, and we start neutralizing it. We bring it to the light. We talk about the shame because like addiction, codependency lives and thrives in shame.
So we start dealing with that. And then the applicable, like the tangible things is exercise. So, so, so important for somebody walking through this experience in their life. Meditation, journaling, music can be a very powerful tool when dealing with a lot of fears and a lot of pain and a lot of discomfort. So we get to the emotional piece of it, but then we also work on what can I do?
like in the moment when I'm in crisis or in the moment where I feel like I'm being suffocated to help me walk outside of that and realize that this is gonna pass. It always has, right? It always will and give me the tools to be able to sit in the discomfort. Cause this is the thing, both addiction and codependency are rooted in the idea that I am adverse to pain. And it isn't until I start accepting, surrendering to, if you will,
Jennifer Chase (42:14.062)
and understanding that life comes with discomfort, life comes with pain, and I'm gonna be okay through it, that's when we can start changing our behavior.
Yes, completely agree with that. For someone listening who feels hopeless and exhausted, what's the first thing you want her to know right now?
I want her to know that she's going to be okay, first of all, and I know it doesn't feel like that, right? There is hope. I have seen it countless and countless of times. I've had mamas call me on the phone and say, I think this is going to kill me, right? Or they say to me, promise me this is going to work. I'll do it if you promise me it's going to work, right? But I don't know how to deal with this anymore. And the thing that they need to do right, right this minute, is start finding their people.
Find the people that understand the feeling of shame and isolation and fear and the people that are walking through this like right now, right? And I have some resources to that. do coaching calls for people all over the country and we bring people together and I do it for that reason, right? Connection, maybe you've heard this before. The opposite of addiction is connection.
And that was true for me, but the opposite of codependency is also connection. And why I do this, right? Like I'm trying to create that connection that, because it's so isolating and fear and all those things just live in this place of isolation. So right now, find, if Al-Anon's your thing, go find an Al-Anon group. If a coaching call like something that I do works, look me up.
Jennifer Chase (43:58.444)
Right, get in contact with me. There are probably people locally that you work with that do similar things that I do, but to me, that's the very, very first step. Before you feel, like that's the first step of just slightly unburying your head up to here, where you can start to breathe and start to kind of put some of these principles into application so that you can start finding some peace.
Yeah, that is a great starting point. I have not heard that before, that the opposite of addiction is connection. Thank you so much for sharing that. That's amazing. What does life feel like now on the other side of those cycles you once thought were unbreakable?
It is the absolute truth.
Jennifer Chase (44:45.006)
Well, that's a great question. I could lie to you and tell you it's just a dream, right? It's just the best thing. I'm just happier than ever. But I believe that I have to be honest and say, it's still not easy, right? The experience that I went through as a childhood, it will be my life work unraveling and navigating my way through this, right? And there are days where I wake up and I'm like,
I am so full of joy. I am so full of gratitude. I just can't even believe this is my life. And then there are days that I still wake up and it feels a little suffocating and it feel like I'm a little mad that I'm still having to do it, right? That the resentments seep in. The great news is I have the tools now to figure out how to move through that, but breaking the chains is not for the weak.
Right? It's just not like there's a reason why not everybody does it because it's a lot of work. It's daily affirmations. It's quieting the critic inside of you. It's quieting the little girl that was traumatized inside of you. It's constantly a no, no, no, no. The grown ass woman is taking a lead here. Right? It's constantly a battle of trying to make that right. And some days is
I can't even believe my life is this great. Literally, right? I cannot believe I live this life. And then other days it's like, well, we're gonna have to do some work today.
Yeah. I feel like that just speaks to the fact that any sort of healing journey is a lifelong journey. there really is no end to it. And it's not linear. Like you are going to have those days where you wake up and it's like, well, yesterday I felt amazing, but today I feel like shit. So yeah.
Jennifer Chase (46:45.07)
So I'm a girl and my higher power speaks to me in quotes. And sometimes I hear a quote and it's just words or whatever. And then sometimes it's penetrates my soul. And there's one that I'd love to share, which is by Joseph Campbell. And it says, the cave I fear to enter holds the treasure I seek. And it speaks to what you're talking about because the treasure that I was seeking was connection and.
and serenity and joy and worth and value and all of the things that we want as human beings, right? But I didn't know how to go inside of the cave because the cave is dark. The cave has stalagmites and bats and batshit for God's sakes all over, right? Like it's not a great place to be. And I never knew would step my foot in there and then it would be like, no, we're not doing this, right? And that was one of the beautiful gifts that
sobriety and recovery had given me is it's like I learned I don't go in that cave by myself, right? Like I take a group of people and that's the connection that I'm talking about. We go in that thing together and then we do my work and then we go, you know, we get out and we go into somebody else's, but this is the thing about the cave. I spend probably 85, 90 % of my time now having found the cave and not needing to be inside of it in order to experience the treasure, right?
Like I get to experience the treasure in the big wild world and it's beautiful and amazing. But there are still days when I have to go back inside of that cave and I have to learn whatever lesson I didn't learn before or whatever experience I need to revisit. So that's, think the beautiful thing about this process of healing from traumas is it's like, it's not the burden that it once was.
And it doesn't spend the time on my heart that it once did, but it will be my life work. That cave will forever be my life.
Jess Vanrose (48:50.402)
That's amazing. My lights are on an auto switch. It's gonna look like a light bulb moment.
It was a lightbulb moment.
Exactly, yes, perfect. To wrap up here, do you have any final things that you want to share?
I just want your audience to know that regardless of what you have walked through, regardless of the people that have told you that you're not enough or that you're not worthy, regardless of your experiences, regardless of what you have done in your past, you are worthy of peace and you are worthy of it. You are going to have to work for it. It is not going to be easy and it is going to be worth it. And I promise you that, right?
There's so many of us that have experienced sexual traumas or traumas as a small child that believe we are broken, believe at our core that we are unworthy of love and peace and serenity and happiness. And I just want every single person out there to know that you are worth it.
Jess Vanrose (49:55.18)
Yes, absolutely. cannot endorse that message enough. So our final question, what does life after trauma mean to you? Wow, that's a
Great question, and I think if you asked me at different stages in my life, I would tell you different answers, but I'm gonna tell you from this grown ass version of the woman that sits before you today. It is peace. It is wholeness. It is worth that comes from within me rather than looking at it from somebody giving it to me from the outside world. And it brings tears to my eyes because my God, fought for it for a long time.
And it took me a lot of years to get here. But life after trauma is the life that I always dreamed of, right? The love and the serenity and the peace and the worthiness and the value and all of the things that I fought so hard for and so long for in my life. That is life after trauma today.
a beautiful answer and the perfect place to end this on. Thank you so much, Jennifer. If people want to work with you because you offer a lot, where can they find you?
So my website is www.riseaddictionlc.com and on my website there's a contact me little button that will lead you to my email and I would love even if you're struggling today and you're like I don't know where to find my people. Reach out to me and I can be your person for a hot second and help you find a direction. I would love if you're struggling with addiction and codependency.
Jennifer Chase (51:41.026)
to help you untangle all of that. So my website is a great place. I'm also on TikTok at Jen Chase, where I share some of my experiences or things that I've walked through, good or bad, to kind of help bring some light to people. And then I'm on Facebook at Jennifer Reinhart Chase.
Perfect. I will have everything linked. I want to say I was watching some of your TikToks the other day and I love your series that you have, the What Was Jennifer Thinking?
What was Jennifer thinking when she was running? I'd love to tell you.
Well, fun, I love it. So definitely go check out her TikTok for sure. Well, thank you again, Jennifer, for coming on and for sharing your story so bravely and all of your wisdom and experience. This has been incredible.
Yeah.
Jennifer Chase (52:34.584)
Thank you, thank you, thank you so much for inviting me on today.
